Critique Fatherly Bond

rusticblonde

rusticblonde

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229
Name
Kirsty
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Yes
Hi folks.

From a recent shoot with a 7 week old baby. I looked and the composition and i know it is a little naff. There was a story behind this. He plays with her like this, he kisses her toes, and smiles at her. I love the eye contact hes making with her. Not sure on lighting overall, but happy to accept CC as per usual :)

DSC_4374-1.jpg
 
Hi Kirsty,

A great moment captured.

A few points of feedback for you.

Light & Post Productoin - The light source used is a hard light. Generally with photographs of family or children you would go for a softer light source which means a larger source closer in. Also I am not keen on the black and white/sepia conversion and much prefer straight colour or black and white regarding colouring of an image.

Composition - The framing seems too tight and restrictive to fit the subject matter. Also if you have a client who asked for a 5x7 print you are stuck with having to crop tighter still, it's best to leave some wriggle room with shoots like this for print sizes because a lot don't fit the camera aspect ratio.

Thanks for sharing.

Rick
 
RJ Bradbury said:
Also if you have a client who asked for a 5x7 print you are stuck with having to crop tighter still, it's best to leave some wriggle room with shoots like this for print sizes because a lot don't fit the camera aspect ratio.
Click to expand...
This is a valid point that is not often spoke about. Very frustrating for sure.


Hi Kirsty. I like the image it is indeed, a nice moment captured. Well done. How did you light tha photo ?

Gaz
 
A lovely moment captured. Which is the most difficult skill to 'learn', I'm not fond of the dad's expression, and I suspect if I'd have 20 frames to choose from there'd have been a slightly more comfortable one.

But the framing and lighting needs some work.

The framing's well covered above, so the lighting?

It's lit from too low, too hard, and emphasising the wrong 'subject', a large softbox from above and carefully placed reflectors would be my recommendation.
 
That's a great effort Kirsty.
Plenty of sound advice above regarding framing.
I've tried very similar in the past and found that flooding with soft light and reflectors works well, especially helping to remove shadow areas (dads chin, shoulders and a strange line on the babies extended arm through her chest/tummy).
Your early efforts still knock mine into a ditch though...
 
Last edited:
RJ Bradbury said:
Hi Kirsty,

A great moment captured.

A few points of feedback for you.

Light & Post Productoin - The light source used is a hard light. Generally with photographs of family or children you would go for a softer light source which means a larger source closer in. Also I am not keen on the black and white/sepia conversion and much prefer straight colour or black and white regarding colouring of an image.

Composition - The framing seems too tight and restrictive to fit the subject matter. Also if you have a client who asked for a 5x7 print you are stuck with having to crop tighter still, it's best to leave some wriggle room with shoots like this for print sizes because a lot don't fit the camera aspect ratio.

Thanks for sharing.

Rick
Click to expand...


Thankyou for this suggestion. Large light source with softbox? Can I ask would u generally use this with a speedlite or a fixed light.

Composition i agree is off. Tbh this was a little bit of a learning curve for me. Im tempted to attempt some cloning to give a little more room. I am looking into a better background set up for the future :)
 
cargo said:
This is a valid point that is not often spoke about. Very frustrating for sure.


Hi Kirsty. I like the image it is indeed, a nice moment captured. Well done. How did you light tha photo ?

Gaz
Click to expand...

Hi Gaz,

This was a Yongnuo Flash with a diffuser which i bounced off the ceiling :). It was fairly high cam left :)
 
Phil V said:
A lovely moment captured. Which is the most difficult skill to 'learn', I'm not fond of the dad's expression, and I suspect if I'd have 20 frames to choose from there'd have been a slightly more comfortable one.

But the framing and lighting needs some work.

The framing's well covered above, so the lighting?

It's lit from too low, too hard, and emphasising the wrong 'subject', a large softbox from above and carefully placed reflectors would be my recommendation.
Click to expand...

Hi Phil,

Thankyou again for the welcomed critique. Again aware the framing is wrong, it is something that i am still looking at learning in depth in order to improve.

Lit too low, would you have suggested i placed the speedlite higher yet still ceiling bounced? Also as for a speedlite with softbox, ive seen similar set ups with lights, would you have suggested a speedlite or light with softbox.

Thankyou again.

Dads expression i had a couple to work with, (see below), and it is one of them they liked the most. He really hates photos no matter how much i told him to relax (also the dude had man flu XD). I thought these were really tight compared to this one, but the points are very duely noted :)

DSC_4373.jpg DSC_4365.jpg
 
rusticblonde said:
Hi Phil,

Thankyou again for the welcomed critique. Again aware the framing is wrong, it is something that i am still looking at learning in depth in order to improve.

Lit too low, would you have suggested i placed the speedlite higher yet still ceiling bounced? Also as for a speedlite with softbox, ive seen similar set ups with lights, would you have suggested a speedlite or light with softbox.

Thankyou again.
Click to expand...


In a small - med softbox you wouldnt be able to tell the difference between a speedlight or a studio head.

In a larger softbox you really need the benefit of the bare bulb.

There's a time and place for using a bare (or thereabouts) speedlight, and this really isn't it.

This is lit with a 120cm octa really close.

Rose-3bw by Phil Vaughan, on Flickr
 
Phil V said:
In a small - med softbox you wouldnt be able to tell the difference between a speedlight or a studio head.

In a larger softbox you really need the benefit of the bare bulb.

There's a time and place for using a bare (or thereabouts) speedlight, and this really isn't it.

This is lit with a 120cm octa really close.

Rose-3bw by Phil Vaughan, on Flickr
Click to expand...

Ah,totally see your point. alot softer on the Face. I used one of those diffusers, but clearly it isnt enough to soften the light. Do you have any good suggestions for decent Octobox you recommend?

Thanks again.
 
Hi Kirsty,

A larger umbrella or soft-box would work. A Soft-box will give more control of light spilling on to the background.

You can use either a speedlite, continuous lights or a studio strobe. The speedlite and strobe will give you far more power and light than any continuous light and the studio strobe has the added benefit of a modelling light to help with light placement, focus and generally not falling over stuff in a studio space :)

If all you have at this time is a speed light grab a 60" convertible umbrella for a very flexible modifier than can give very soft light or you can fire it through a bed sheet, a reflector or bounce it off a wall but watch out the the raw hard light from those little diffuses you can put on speedlites. Those things do not make a speedlite softer.

Regarding light placement that will depend on your subject/subject height but I will generally always go for the light above. If you look at most light sources that we see in day to day life they are above you.

Rick
 
Dependant on budget...

Bessel do a 120cm Octa with a 4cm grid for £90, which is similar to mine (mine was free but that's complicated)

Some people will say 120 is too big for a domestic setting, if you think they might be right get a 95cm one.

Or one of these brolly softboxes will give a large soft lightsource that's not quite so controllable.
There are cheaper ways of starting, but I can tell you for certain that most people who upgrade incrementally will spend a lot of money on kit they only use for a short time (till they discover the limitations).
 
This image whilst not lit with a 60" umbrella it was lit with a large 50" soft-box placed over head (in front) of the mother and child and the bottom edge tilted slightly down.

Because it'a a large source used close it's nice and soft and also covers the full length seated pose with out the need for deliberate fill cards or reflectors, that said the white faced hardboard on the floor does that duty.

I could of got a similar look with the umbrella in shoot through configuration.

The light used was a PITA (pain in the ass.. long story) Bowens 500ws studio strobe.

Pippa & Sky - Ballet... by Richard Bradbury, on Flickr
 
Phil V said:
Dependant on budget...

Bessel do a 120cm Octa with a 4cm grid for £90, which is similar to mine (mine was free but that's complicated)

Some people will say 120 is too big for a domestic setting, if you think they might be right get a 95cm one.

Or one of these brolly softboxes will give a large soft lightsource that's not quite so controllable.
There are cheaper ways of starting, but I can tell you for certain that most people who upgrade incrementally will spend a lot of money on kit they only use for a short time (till they discover the limitations).
Click to expand...

Hi Phil,

Sorry didnt notice the ping for this post. Thanks for these great suggestions as usual.
 
RJ Bradbury said:
Hi Kirsty,

A larger umbrella or soft-box would work. A Soft-box will give more control of light spilling on to the background.

You can use either a speedlite, continuous lights or a studio strobe. The speedlite and strobe will give you far more power and light than any continuous light and the studio strobe has the added benefit of a modelling light to help with light placement, focus and generally not falling over stuff in a studio space :)

If all you have at this time is a speed light grab a 60" convertible umbrella for a very flexible modifier than can give very soft light or you can fire it through a bed sheet, a reflector or bounce it off a wall but watch out the the raw hard light from those little diffuses you can put on speedlites. Those things do not make a speedlite softer.

Regarding light placement that will depend on your subject/subject height but I will generally always go for the light above. If you look at most light sources that we see in day to day life they are above you.

Rick
Click to expand...

Thanks for these suggestions Rick, really helped.
 
Phil V said:
Dependant on budget...

Bessel do a 120cm Octa with a 4cm grid for £90, which is similar to mine (mine was free but that's complicated)

Some people will say 120 is too big for a domestic setting, if you think they might be right get a 95cm one.

Or one of these brolly softboxes will give a large soft lightsource that's not quite so controllable.
There are cheaper ways of starting, but I can tell you for certain that most people who upgrade incrementally will spend a lot of money on kit they only use for a short time (till they discover the limitations).
Click to expand...

stupid question, as ive never used a softbox before. That Bessel that you sent me. Does the speedlites lite fire through the black material?
 
RJ Bradbury said:
This image whilst not lit with a 60" umbrella it was lit with a large 50" soft-box placed over head (in front) of the mother and child and the bottom edge tilted slightly down.

Because it'a a large source used close it's nice and soft and also covers the full length seated pose with out the need for deliberate fill cards or reflectors, that said the white faced hardboard on the floor does that duty.

I could of got a similar look with the umbrella in shoot through configuration.

The light used was a PITA (pain in the ass.. long story) Bowens 500ws studio strobe.

Pippa & Sky - Ballet... by Richard Bradbury, on Flickr
Click to expand...

Beautiful shot :)
 
rusticblonde said:
stupid question, as ive never used a softbox before. That Bessel that you sent me. Does the speedlites lite fire through the black material?
Click to expand...
You see the image with the mount on the back of the softbox, it's called an S-type mount, it's designed to fit on a studio flash with an s-type mount (including Lencarta / Godox), you can buy a bracket to mount your speedlight.

But as I said earlier a speedlight isn't designed to work in a large softbox, softboxes are designed to work with a bare bulb on a studio head.

If you can wait till March, you could look at gear at the Photography show in Birmingham.
 
Phil V said:
You see the image with the mount on the back of the softbox, it's called an S-type mount, it's designed to fit on a studio flash with an s-type mount (including Lencarta / Godox), you can buy a bracket to mount your speedlight.

But as I said earlier a speedlight isn't designed to work in a large softbox, softboxes are designed to work with a bare bulb on a studio head.

If you can wait till March, you could look at gear at the Photography show in Birmingham.
Click to expand...

oh ok. I may look into getting some tickets for that. Friend of mine mentioned it. I will consider both options imho as considering a studio when i have some form of standard to my work :)

Youre a legend Phil. Thankyou as always
 
Phil V said:
There are cheaper ways of starting, but I can tell you for certain that most people who upgrade incrementally will spend a lot of money on kit they only use for a short time (till they discover the limitations).
Click to expand...

LISTEN TO THIS!! I've given away a fair amount of my early purchases and the only reason I've still got the rest is that I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

You don't need to buy Profoto or Broncolor stuff but there's a reason that studio strobes & softboxes are such a standard.
 
juggler said:
LISTEN TO THIS!! I've given away a fair amount of my early purchases and the only reason I've still got the rest is that I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

You don't need to buy Profoto or Broncolor stuff but there's a reason that studio strobes & softboxes are such a standard.
Click to expand...

Ive heard alot about Godox? Or Gobox? Are these any good? I obviously want something decent :)
 
Re Godox.

Its heavily rebranded.

UK suppliers are Pixapro or Lencarta. I have had great service from Pixapro so far.

Studio strobes from either are a great. Like @juggler said no need to spend a ton on Profoto etc.

My lighting kit is evolving and a fair bit of it is either Pixapro or Lencarta.

Solid kit.

Buy something bowens s- mount when you do.

However you can still do a lot with that speedlite you own. You can always learn and grow with that and then buy in to studio kit gradually.
 
juggler said:
Not entirely true according to @Garry Edwards, formerly of Lencarta and still - I think - of this parish.

Lencarta do rebadge the Atom models, but the rest are made to their own (claimed) higher specification.
Click to expand...
May be but it looks the same.

My take on it is pick the supplier who gives good support and you will be good. I am not prepared to deal with Godox direct but Pixapro and Lencarta will sort issues out in the UK.
 
juggler said:
Not entirely true according to @Garry Edwards, formerly of Lencarta and still - I think - of this parish.

Lencarta do rebadge the Atom models, but the rest are made to their own (claimed) higher specification.
Click to expand...
Not true in the case of Lencarta, same case, different contents - proven, not just claimed.
RJ Bradbury said:
May be but it looks the same.

My take on it is pick the supplier who gives good support and you will be good. I am not prepared to deal with Godox direct but Pixapro and Lencarta will sort issues out in the UK.
Click to expand...
Good idea. But make sure that the good support really does exist, for example although Lencarta's warranty is totally unconditional, you may want to read the Pixapro one carefully.
 
Garry Edwards said:
Not true in the case of Lencarta, same case, different contents - proven, not just claimed.

Good idea. But make sure that the good support really does exist, for example although Lencarta's warranty is totally unconditional, you may want to read the Pixapro one carefully.
Click to expand...

Garry,

I have had no problems from either company re warranty or repairs as of yet.


Currently I have..(in case the OP is interested)

1 Lencarta Elite Pro 2 600 - Solid light that can be driven 1/2 to 1/1 power all day with out complaining (unlike bowens)
4 Lencarta Smart Flash 1 200ws heads - On long term loan from a good friend. I want to replace these because they are just not consistent nor powerful enough. That said they have got the job done and have been a huge help getting my studio going.
1 Pixapro Hybrid 360II ETTL
1 Pixapro Li-ION 580ETTL Speedlite
3 Canon 430 EXII
2 Pixapro ST-III Transmitters
3 Pixapro ST-III Receivers

As I make some changes to my lighting kit I will be going with who ever has the kit I need in stock which at the moment is Pixapro because I want to move to heads that have the integrated or attached usb 2.4ghz receiver to build a lighting kit eco system that works well together.

The only difference I can see warranty wise is the extra year you offer.

I have great kit from both companies and have received the support that I would expect also. That's why I pointed the OP to both companies as they offer UK stock and UK support/point of contact. Screw saving a few £ and dealing with sending units back to China at my cost.

Also congratulations on your retirement, all the best Garry.
 
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