So so disheartened with my studio shots. Cannot seem to eliminate blur. Please help.

wonderer

wonderer

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Hi all

Just wanted to get some advice as I am really getting down with my studio images. Every time I think I am making progress I do some shots and they come back anywhere between mediocre and just plain bad. I cannot seem to get sharp photos no matter what settings I use or any other variables I try. I have a home studio and have two large softboxes at 45 degree angles either side and above as a standard setup.

The shot attached is a perfect example of my problem. Motion blur, grainy and not even remotely sharp. The problem is there is nothing jumping out at me from the settings which could be causing this. My two 400 watt lights are on two thirds power ( I hate using them on full power), there is not a great deal of ambient light in the room ( you need some just to be able to photograph children). Kids will naturally run around but I thought studio strobes were meant to freeze the action for the most part?

Please, please can anyone see from this image, my setup or from the exif data anything which may be causing these quite frankly bad photos. There are a couple more examples from the same shoot on the flickr page. I shoot never lower than 1/125 second and always aim for focus on the eyes. These photos dont even look like the lens has locked focus on ANYTHING but I have set my Nikon D7100 to only complete the shutter press once focus has been achieved. They are also just so flat and lifeless.

Please can someone help as my passion for this subject is taking a real beating at the moment as I just dont seem to be overcoming the problems I have no matter how hard I try or how much I learn :(


RMP_9508 by wonderer99, on Flickr
 
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Magnus said:
Try one with ambient lights off, just use the flashes
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Thanks for your reply. There is hardly any ambient light in the room at all. Literally just enough to see by. I have a blackout blind up and it is pretty dark. There is just enough to see by without it being black. This is what is so frustrating for me. I think I have covered the bases and yet still ahve the same problems!
 
Looking at those pictures it seems to be motion blur rather than anything else. Either your subject is moving, likely given her age, and/or camera shake. Are you hand holding or using a tripod ? I was convinced my D7k was suffereing from the well documented focus problems but it was just my crap hand holding technique :LOL: Whilst trolling the net I have found various references stating that the shutter button is harder to press on the D7 variants than other slr's and this could cause problems with camera shake but this being my first slr I have nothing to compare it too so I'm still going with the theory that my technique needs work. Problems disappear when using a tripod or monopod !!
 
Magnus said:
What's your flash duration?
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Um......it goes realllly fast! :LOL:

Phil Young said:
Looks to me like your speed is too slow and her hand moved faster than your shutter could freeze... I wouldn't shoot kids slower than 1/250th
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I have a wireless trigger attached (Interfit trigger that came with the lighting) How do I get a faster sync speed because anything faster than 1/160 and the shutter is too fast.

TAT2 said:
Looking at those pictures it seems to be motion blur rather than anything else. Either your subject is moving, likely given her age, and/or camera shake. Are you hand holding or using a tripod ? I was convinced my D7k was suffereing from the well documented focus problems but it was just my crap hand holding technique :LOL: Whilst trolling the net I have found various references stating that the shutter button is harder to press on the D7 variants than other slr's and this could cause problems with camera shake but this being my first slr I have nothing to compare it too so I'm still going with the theory that my technique needs work. Problems disappear when using a tripod or monopod !!
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I like to think im pretty good with hand holding. Its pretty secure. I absolutely HATE using a tripod in the studio, especially with kids. It just does not feel right for me. I mean I know its entirely possible to hand hold when using studio strobes so I just cannot work out why they are not freezing the action more? I keep hearing that shutter speed is notreally relavent when using studio flash but that has not been my experience. I seem to need every little bit of help to freeze motion.
 
wonderer said:
Um......it goes realllly fast! :LOL:



I have a wireless trigger attached (Interfit trigger that came with the lighting) How do I get a faster sync speed because anything faster than 1/160 and the shutter is too fast.



I like to think im pretty good with hand holding. Its pretty secure. I absolutely HATE using a tripod in the studio, especially with kids. The kids I shoot are ALWAYS moving quickly as I prefer not to pose them so much to get natural shots so what can I do to counter this extreme movement? It just does not feel right for me. I mean I know its entirely possible to hand hold when using studio strobes so I just cannot work out why they are not freezing the action more? I keep hearing that shutter speed is notreally relavent when using studio flash but that has not been my experience. I seem to need every little bit of help to freeze motion.
Click to expand...
 
If you're using flash then 1/125 definitely isn't a problem. Either ambient light is too bright or flash duration is too long.
 
I have never shot inside with flashes like this but a few observations.

On my screen this shot and some of the others on your Flickr stream look a bit underexposed to me, probably about half a stop or so, the background - I assume it is white, does not look light enough.

Good exposure is critical to good image quality, if you don't get the best out of the sensor at capture you will be chasing image quality with one hand tied behind your back.

The blurred hand tells me something is not quite right, either there is more light in the room than you think, or the flash has a very long duration??? The girls face in this shot looks like it's showing a bit of movement/ghosting that has taken the edge of the sharpness.

Lastly it may be that the lens you are using is just not capable of the sharpness and contrast you are looking for, I'm not familiar with the Nikon range but just a thought.

I'd get hold of a an inanimate subject and try with the room lights off and see what you get.

I'm sure there will be enough help on here to get to the bottom of your problem one way or another.

David
 
We'll start with the basics, when shooting in studio conditions like this the things I want to set and forget are:
ISO as low as possible - so 100
Shutter speed - max sync, or as close as the flashes allow. If you know you can use 1/160 why use 1/125? Have you tried other triggers? I'd hope for 1/200 but some studio lights won't.
Light power and aperture to suit, I know lots of studio photographers use f8, you've gone to f11 which is the start of diffraction territory and may add to your lack of sharpness.

All the above and some general info

If you want a white BG, it needs lighting, and you need more of an infinity curve rather than your BG having a wall and floor with the distinct line. How sharp is the 18-105 generally? And how good is it at holding or following focus?
 
The problem is movement blur, caused by a long flash duration, a very common problem with cheaper end studio flash.

Either accept it or do something about it...
Accepting it is an option - you have a small child, moving her hand quite quickly, it's perfectly natural to expect that movement to show as blur, it looks natural so do you really need to "correct" it?
Doing something about it probably means changing your lights. However, you need to be aware that conventional studio lights produce their shortest flash durations at full power, so increasing the power to maximum will help.
 
Magnus said:
If you're using flash then 1/125 definitely isn't a problem. Either ambient light is too bright or flash duration is too long.
Click to expand...

I dont think I can get my ambient light down anymore without causing serious autofocus roaming problems.

Willid1 said:
I have never shot inside with flashes like this but a few observations.

On my screen this shot and some of the others on your Flickr stream look a bit underexposed to me, probably about half a stop or so, the background - I assume it is white, does not look light enough.

Good exposure is critical to good image quality, if you don't get the best out of the sensor at capture you will be chasing image quality with one hand tied behind your back.

The blurred hand tells me something is not quite right, either there is more light in the room than you think, or the flash has a very long duration??? The girls face in this shot looks like it's showing a bit of movement/ghosting that has taken the edge of the sharpness.

Lastly it may be that the lens you are using is just not capable of the sharpness and contrast you are looking for, I'm not familiar with the Nikon range but just a thought.

I'd get hold of a an inanimate subject and try with the room lights off and see what you get.

I'm sure there will be enough help on here to get to the bottom of your problem one way or another.

David
Click to expand...

Thanks very much for your reply. This site is great and I honestly have leart so much here. Its when you try to put into practice over and over the things you have learnt and they still dont work, thats when the real frustrations begin! The lighting I have is this Interfit kit, two heads on the subject. http://www.interfitphotographic.com/lighitng/Product Pages/EX400 Ti.php

I dont think changing flash duration is an option?

Phil V said:
We'll start with the basics, when shooting in studio conditions like this the things I want to set and forget are:
ISO as low as possible - so 100
Shutter speed - max sync, or as close as the flashes allow. If you know you can use 1/160 why use 1/125? Have you tried other triggers? I'd hope for 1/200 but some studio lights won't.
Light power and aperture to suit, I know lots of studio photographers use f8, you've gone to f11 which is the start of diffraction territory and may add to your lack of sharpness.

All the above and some general info

If you want a white BG, it needs lighting, and you need more of an infinity curve rather than your BG having a wall and floor with the distinct line. How sharp is the 18-105 generally? And how good is it at holding or following focus?
Click to expand...

Thanks very much for your reply, I apreciate it. Some more info. At this point I need to say the space I am working in is pretty small and I do have issues with subject/background distance etc ( hence the non existant infinity curve). This I just put up with and/or fix in pp as short of moving home there is little I can do. My main concern is the blur/sharpness issue. As noted the shots are a little underesposed.The two subject lights ( the trigger is encorporated into the package. See link above ) are on three quarter power about 6 foot above and to the side of the subjects. I have the ISO set slightly higer just to raise the exposure slightly and I flit between F8-F13 at various times to try to tackle the issue with little success.
 
To the OP

do your lights have modelling lights & are you using them?
 
Diving Pete said:
To the OP

do your lights have modelling lights & are you using them?
Click to expand...

No, the lights have them but I have never used them. Another question I want to ask is what would the best autofocus mode to use for active kids? I have always used the AF-C mode on the Nikon as this makes the most sense surely?
 
Blur issues:
I'd suggest you move your lights as close as possible and reduce the power. This is going to shorten the flash duration which is what freezes motion w/ flash. You could also push the ISO/ open up the aperture a bit in order to reduce flash power/duration. I don't think you need to be at f/11.. Moving the lights closer will also drop the BG darker without additional lighting there.

If ambient is quite low then the SS isn't the problem; but I'd still prefer to get it higher.
 
Use single point AF, not any dynamic mode. Current Nikon cameras (I'm not sure when this started) are NOT using just the highlighted AF point when in a dynamic (tracking) mode. They are using the highlighted point AND any of the 8 points immediately around it; whichever one has the easiest lock.

The D7100 is a very demanding camera; It requires better lenses and higher SS's (or shorter flash durations) than any other current Nikon does...
 
wonderer said:
Thanks very much for your reply, I apreciate it. Some more info. At this point I need to say the space I am working in is pretty small and I do have issues with subject/background distance etc ( hence the non existant infinity curve). This I just put up with and/or fix in pp as short of moving home there is little I can do. My main concern is the blur/sharpness issue. As noted the shots are a little underesposed.The two subject lights ( the trigger is encorporated into the package. See link above ) are on three quarter power about 6 foot above and to the side of the subjects. I have the ISO set slightly higer just to raise the exposure slightly and I flit between F8-F13 at various times to try to tackle the issue with little success.
Click to expand...
I know where your initial problems lie, however there's no point in chasing the answer to your blurred hands when you haven't got the basics nailed. So get your exposure sorted.
Your exposure settings for flash are determined by Subject distance, flash power, ISO, and aperture, your SS is only important when it becomes so short it clips the flash exposure. Why shoot at f11 and be 2 stops underexposed if you can shoot at f5.6, or even turn your lights up and be correctly exposed.
The upside of that is that is that your lights will burn shorter if you turn them up, on full power they may well cure your problem.

You said you don't like to use them on full power but didn't say why.

And just to resurrect an old hobby horse. If you haven't got room to light a white background properly; don't fudge it, shoot with something more interesting.
 
wonderer said:
No, the lights have them but I have never used them. Another question I want to ask is what would the best autofocus mode to use for active kids? I have always used the AF-C mode on the Nikon as this makes the most sense surely?
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take a shot with your modelling lights on and your flash trigger off. you should get a black pic or near as damn it. 125/250thsec shutter speed +eg f8 should give you nothing, as to dark to fast to record an image.
you should be using your modelling lights they assist with focus move your lights as close as you can and turn up the power more light equals faster (equivalent shutter speed).you should be able to achieve something like 1/800sec or more using studio lights.hth mike.
also your not shooting an adult so get your light down low to the child's height.(y)
 
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sk66 said:
Blur issues:
I'd suggest you move your lights as close as possible and reduce the power. This is going to shorten the flash duration which is what freezes motion w/ flash. You could also push the ISO/ open up the aperture a bit in order to reduce flash power/duration. I don't think you need to be at f/11.. Moving the lights closer will also drop the BG darker without additional lighting there.

If ambient is quite low then the SS isn't the problem; but I'd still prefer to get it higher.
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Sorry, but that answer is 100% wrong.
 
Ah, yes...
The type of strobe does make a difference... sorry I neglected to note that.
If your strobe is gate thyristor controlled what I said is correct (many modern "high speed" strobes are.. i.e Einsteins. All speedlights)
If your strobes are (the more standard?) capacitor discharge type then what I wrote is actually "backwards"...

The specs for your strobes should give flash duration times at various power levels...
 
Please just try this:
put camera in manual setting.

1/250
F8
ISO 100
Single point AF-S - not AF-C

Turn the modelling lights ON, this will mean that the camera is able to focus correctly & so should also mean a sharp picture.
Set the lights power to expose for those settings.
 
note to the OP - this is a test setting - to try and eliminate the your issues.

The modelling lights 'should' automatically dim when the flash is fired & will have no impact on the actual picture.
 
Thanks to all who have replied so far, I genuinely apreciate the advice. I will be trying all suggestions tomorrow to see if I can achieve better results. I have never been able to get a faster SS than 1/160 on my Nikon D7100, does anyone know if this is the fastest it can be used with studio strobes? I cannot seem to find an absolute answer.
 
but this is more for camera shake than the actual image ....
I'm positive that someone (Garry, Hoppy)etc, etc can explain it better but the FLASH will expose the picture in the brief split second that it fires & the fact that your shutter speed is 1/60 or 1/250 shouldn't make a difference... but it will IF:
1. You suffer from shaky hands.
2. the AF isn't locking due to not enough ambient light (from not running the modelling lights)
 
wonderer said:
Thanks to all who have replied so far, I genuinely apreciate the advice. I will be trying all suggestions tomorrow to see if I can achieve better results. I have never been able to get a faster SS than 1/160 on my Nikon D7100, does anyone know if this is the fastest it can be used with studio strobes? I cannot seem to find an absolute answer.
Click to expand...
shoot at 1/200 if it has a black line on the pic its to fast, if not go faster till a black line appears then back off slightly.the black line is the shutter beginning to close before the exposure is complete hth mike
 
Diving Pete said:
but this is more for camera shake than the actual image ....
I'm positive that someone (Garry, Hoppy)etc, etc can explain it better but the FLASH will expose the picture in the brief split second that it fires & the fact that your shutter speed is 1/60 or 1/250 shouldn't make a difference... but it will IF:
1. You suffer from shaky hands.
2. the AF isn't locking due to not enough ambient light (from not running the modelling lights)
Click to expand...
dinorock said:
shoot at 1/200 if it has a black line on the pic its to fast, if not go faster till a black line appears then back off slightly.the black line is the shutter beginning to close before the exposure is complete hth mike
Click to expand...


Yes the shutter is visible from 250. As I say 160 is the quickest I can shoot to it seems.
 
But even at 1/160 your 'exposure' is the length of the flash duration, and the only way to shorten that is to turn up your flash power (it's complicated, but with most studio flash your flash will be faster at higher power, with flashguns the opposite is true).

You might want to try alternative flash triggers though, as there is a delay on cheaper circuits and you might just be able to get to max sync speed (experiment also with a cable).
 
I very much doubt whether the OP can shoot at 1/250th - not that there's any point in doing that anyway...

In theory, the sync speed is determined only by the camera, i.e. by the physical speed at which the shutter moves, which is why high end cameras tend to have faster possible sync speeds than cheaper ones. Basically, both shutter curtains have to be fully open at the moment the flash fires, if one of them isn't fully open then you'll get a blurred image of the shutter curtain at the bottom of the pic.

Basically, it's possible to achieve the theoretical maximum with a hotshoe flashgun pluggged into the hotshoe, or with either a flashgun or a studio flash connected via a PC cable, or when using a good quality radio trigger that doesn't have any delays caused by poor design, but many radio triggers struggle to do it.

There's no point in shooting at 1/250th anyway, 1/125th is more than short enough for any normal situation, unless you've got bright sunlight streaming through the window. Normal room lighting is pretty irrelevant, and the modelling lamps, at just 75watts, are too feeble to make any difference even if they're used.
 
yep you are right but as I already asked how are you triggering the studio lights - the op may be using the pop up... he hasn't yet told us.
 
Diving Pete said:
yep you are right but as I already asked how are you triggering the studio lights - the op may be using the pop up... he hasn't yet told us.
Click to expand...

I did say in post number 13 with a link to the lights and incorporated trigger.
 
If the trigger is infrared, I'd definitely recommend some radio triggers.
 
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